User talk:SiBr4

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Revision as of 12:06, 22 March 2013
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:::[[w:ISO 3166-1|ISO 3166-1]] defines codes for both countries and dependencies, so them having the ISO 3166-1 GG, JE and IM codes doesn't say anything about whether they are countries or not: other dependencies like [[w:Bermuda|Bermuda]] (BM) and [[w:Guam|Guam]] (GU) have "country" codes as well, as do some integral parts of countries like [[w:French Guiana|French Guiana]] (GF) and the [[w:Caribbean Netherlands|Dutch special municipalities]] (BQ). Most WP ranking lists too list both countries and dependencies, as do most others. I wonder if any list/categorization by country anywhere includes the crown dependencies but doesn't include the [[w:British Overseas Territories|BOT]]s, the [[w:U.S. insular area|U.S. insular area]]s, the Chinese [[w:Special administrative region|SAR]]s, etc.
 
:::[[w:ISO 3166-1|ISO 3166-1]] defines codes for both countries and dependencies, so them having the ISO 3166-1 GG, JE and IM codes doesn't say anything about whether they are countries or not: other dependencies like [[w:Bermuda|Bermuda]] (BM) and [[w:Guam|Guam]] (GU) have "country" codes as well, as do some integral parts of countries like [[w:French Guiana|French Guiana]] (GF) and the [[w:Caribbean Netherlands|Dutch special municipalities]] (BQ). Most WP ranking lists too list both countries and dependencies, as do most others. I wonder if any list/categorization by country anywhere includes the crown dependencies but doesn't include the [[w:British Overseas Territories|BOT]]s, the [[w:U.S. insular area|U.S. insular area]]s, the Chinese [[w:Special administrative region|SAR]]s, etc.
 
:::In Wikipedia's [[w:Dependent territory|Dependent territory]] article, Jersey, Guernsey and the Isle of Man are grouped under "Crown dependencies", but they are still in the [[w:Dependent territory#Lists of dependent territories|Lists of dependent territories]] section. There is a separate section for areas with special status (like the [[w:Aland Islands|Aland Islands]] and [[w:Hong Kong|Hong Kong]]/[[w:Macau|Macau]]), but the CDs aren't part of that. And why would they even be called "crown dependencies" if they aren't dependencies? [[User:SiBr4|SiBr₄]] ([[User talk:SiBr4|talk]]) 08:42, 20 March 2013 (UTC)
 
:::In Wikipedia's [[w:Dependent territory|Dependent territory]] article, Jersey, Guernsey and the Isle of Man are grouped under "Crown dependencies", but they are still in the [[w:Dependent territory#Lists of dependent territories|Lists of dependent territories]] section. There is a separate section for areas with special status (like the [[w:Aland Islands|Aland Islands]] and [[w:Hong Kong|Hong Kong]]/[[w:Macau|Macau]]), but the CDs aren't part of that. And why would they even be called "crown dependencies" if they aren't dependencies? [[User:SiBr4|SiBr₄]] ([[User talk:SiBr4|talk]]) 08:42, 20 March 2013 (UTC)
 
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::::Finally getting back to this at the end of a busy week. The thing about the Crown Dependencies is that they are dependencies of the Crown (naturally enough), not of the UK - the sovereign power being the Crown, and again not the UK (think of the way the Crown is different in Australia and Canada, even though the same person is monarch). Since ''Foo in the CDs'' are by definition not in the UK, and ''Foo of the CDs'' are by definition not of the UK, it is logical to categorise by country. Since the flags (getting back to the particular issue at hand) of the CDs are specifically used to symbolise the separate identities of the countries (which the UK agrees are identities that are different from that of the UK - see the Framework Agreements), it is evident that flags of the CDs are ''per se'' not flags of the UK. The UK Ministry makes it clear: "[http://www.justice.gov.uk/downloads/about/moj/our-responsibilities/Background_Briefing_on_the_Crown_Dependencies2.pdf Government officials must never state or imply that the Crown Dependencies are part of the United Kingdom]". The CDs are self-governing, if non-sovereign, countries and whether they happen for historical reasons to be titled "Crown dependencies" or "Crown countries" doesn't change the nature of the relationship with the Crown. [[User:Man vyi|Man vyi]] ([[User talk:Man vyi|talk]]) 12:06, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

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